Wow, so many questions from this episode… Why wasn’t Sun sent back in time w/ the other Losties from the plane? Is she too jaded/semi-bad now for the Island to “want” her? Not that Ben didn’t deserve the conk over the head she gave him… How is it possible for her and Frank, Ben and the others to be on the same island in a different time period? How can the Island exist in two time periods at once??I don’t know about y’all but it’s so odd seeing Sawyer/James/Jim/LaFleur as the leader, the go-to guy who figures things out. I liked that he called Jack out on the book thing toward the end, but that definitely shows that he still has quite a bit of hostility built up toward Jack. The awkwardness now between Sawyer and Juliet is hard to watch, sad considering how happy they seemed in the last episode.
How great was the end with Ben bringing Sayid his sandwich?! It took a second for me to realize it was young-Ben after hearing his pre-pubescent voice saying he was dropping off the sandwich. Poor Sayid, he has no freakin’ clue what’s going on, but he must have figured out he was back in time w/ the Dharma Initiative, and put two-and-two together when the kid said his name.
So now we have some perspective on the amount of time the Dharma folks have left. Ben was an adult when he gassed them all to death, so they prob still have a good 5-8 years left. I was wondering about the Dharma facilities Sun and Frank found and why they were so trashed since we saw the Others living in them comfortably. My friend suggested maybe the folks in Dharma-time change something in the future, or, she also reminded me about the freighter soldiers who were blowing houses up, maybe that’s how they left it…does anyone remember?
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I would agree that that area of Dharmaville was pretty messed up by the freighter soldiers. Remember that house that Mother-of-Aaron (I forget her name at the moment) was in was blown to smithereens.
Another two questions I would like to raise (1 related directly to this episode, 1 from long ago):
1) What happened to Dan? Sawyer had a tone in his voice that made me think Dan stabbed them in the back somehow. Though we know he was there long enough to at least start working for Dharma since he was shown building the time-travel station.
2) If the Dharma initiative was wiped out in the 80s or 90s (I would argue that Ben could have been anywhere from his late teens to early 20s when he killed everyone), why in 2001 when the Losties were first there were there still helicopters dropping off pallets of Dharma food/supplies. And how were those helicopters finding the island?
Yeah I remembered they blew up Claire's house, just couldn't remember what happened after that.
Very good questions, I also wondered what Sawyer meant when Jack asked if Faraday was there and he replied "not anymore" or something like that. I think he flipped out a little after Charlotte died and realizing he was back in time to when she was there as a child. Maybe he either went crazy and ran off into the jungle?
I also wondered about the Dharma supplies and how Des was able to get fresh fruit and such even after the Dharma folks were wiped out. In addition to wondering about how the helicopters could find the island I also wondered how the submarine could too...
I wondered about why the village was in shambles when Sun was there too but then thought "maybe that's just 3 years of neglect on the island" since technically everyone else got zapped away to the past, or escaped from the island. Except for those Others... wouldn't they have moved back into the village after the Losties were all gone?
I think Ben is going to be a little mad at Sun, I wonder what he'll do to get her back... he's always acting so aloof "come with me or not, I don't care" when you know he secretly is manipulating everything to go exactly as he wants.
I forgot about Faraday, and, where's Locke? Oh that's right, he shows up slightly after Sun's plane crash, after Sun/Pilot left?
Wouldn't the future Miles/Dr Chang thing have come up, considering they've been coexisting together for a while? Miles certainly would recognize his dad....
Maybe Ben manipulated the dharma contacts who provided supplies into thinking survivors were still there and supplies were still needed. Good question as to how they located the island.. or that the sub does. Hmmm! Maybe in the 70s the time travel stuff hadn't happened yet so it's easy to find, but that doesn't explain the pallet of the 2000s.
I'm wondering what will happen about the "upcoming war" that .. Widmore?.. warned about. Also, now that we know more of the old dharma people, who was the guy who told Desmond about the button in the first place? Didn't desmond find out he was lying and kill him..? maybe it was an Other.
I'm still happy that my best Lost discovery was back during those Hatch episodes, I figured out that if you add up the numbers, you get 108. Yay.. though it didn't unlock any secrets or anything so far. :)
So we're also still waiting for what will happen to the island that causes infertility problems. Is that giant statue already knocked down in the 70s? I can see several more seasons to explain all these details!
I think it makes sense that the helicopters and submarine could make it to the island when The Others knew where the island was and what path/coordinates to come in on. I just didn't understand why a Dharma helicopter would keep coming to deliver food & supplies. I think Anne has the most likely scenario that Ben maybe manipulated Dharma into still making deliveries somehow. Though that would require allowing Dharma to know how to get to the island and therefore risk the Others' safety. I don't know how they are possibly going to explain that later on...
One other thing I noticed in this episode which is also related to the proper path/coordinates to arrive at the island. When the plane was crashing in this episode, they clearly showed it was nighttime as they started crashing, the Losties disappeared, and then it was daytime. I suspect that the plane did not come in on the proper path and therefore did that slight/couple-hours time travel thing that happens (like when that dead doctor from the freighter washed ashore *before* he died on the freighter). So, maybe since they came in on the wrong path, the Losties who had Sawyer and Juliette as an "anchor" (or whatever Faraday referred to people who can keep you from going crazy from time travelling) got pulled back into the 70s. This doesn't explain Sun at all though since clearly if there is anybody who is an anchor for Sun, it would be Jin. Maybe Sun was just on the wrong side of the plane...
As for Faraday, I remember him looking at the holes in the wall under the time-travel station oddly. Maybe he started up his time travel experiments again trying to use himself to save Charlotte and turned himself into a vegetable like he did to that woman who Widmore now cares for.
I also don't think there is actually a Dr. Chang/Miles connection. That's a good point that he would recognize his dad. I think his nose was just bleeding cause they were all getting pretty messed up from the time travel. If he had been born on the island like Charlotte and there for a couple years, he probably would have at least gotten closer to death.
As far as the shambles of Dharmaville. Who says that the plane has actually crashed 3 years after the Losties left? It would be the most likely idea, but who knows. Maybe they are far in the future even. It would be quite a season closer for Ben to finally make it back to all the Others and Richard says something like, "Ben, it is 2011. You've been gone a decade."
Yeah, I loved seeing Sawyer be the take-charge, man on the scene. I guess I never noticed before James "LaFleur" pointed it out, but he was exactly right about Jack's decision making skills. He never took the time to thinking things through. He was driven by emotions, and always has been.
Regarding Dan, I believe we are going to find out this coming week where he went, and why James was a little ticked about his going. If for nothing else, James might feel like he abandoned the rest of the survivors to run off after some wild theory. That would be enough to cause James to sneer when mentioning Dan, something James has a tenancy to do about most anyone.
BTW - the stacks of food were discovered in season 2's "Lockdown" where the blast-door came down on Locke's legs, and where he saw the inviso-map. The blast-doors came down at the same time the food was dropped, probably not coincidentally. We do not know what vehicle was used to drop it, but it was not likely by helicopter. The food pallet was very large and heavy, and came down on a parachute with a blinking light. It is very likely that it was dropped from something like a C-130 that could not only handle the weight, but also a high enough altitude that would prevent anyone from hearing it as it passed.
I don't know who it was that dropped off the food supplies or how they found the island, but we know why. They were providing for the button-pusher, which leads me to a theory I have working in my head.
In this very episode, the DI people were designing "The Swan," a.k.a. "The Hatch." A few years prior, Dan told the indigenous people (a.k.a. "The Hostiles") to bury the hydrogen bomb. I'd think, the odd electromagnetic energy emitted from the island had a strange reaction to the bomb being buried there, so the DI designed The Swan to relieve the building waves of energy. Someone would have to continue to release that energy with Hurley's cursed numbers, by pushing the button.
(theory continued...) That brings me to another idea I have about why women were able to give birth before they built the Swan, but after, not so much. I think, in their haste and limited knowledge of technology in the 70's, they were dispersing that energy back into the surface of the island. They unknowingly caused people to become "infected" (such as Danielle's shipmates and husband...
say... by the way... I wonder if there is any relation of DAN to DANielle... anyway, back to my theory...)
This "infection" also affected the most vulnerable, the pregnant, and the unborn - perhaps, with a deadly combination of radioactivity and electromagnetism working at opposite polarities. The later hyper-activates the cells while the former hyper-degrades them until both mother and baby die from the trauma.
Getting back to the food supplies, I remember every single thing being labeled "Dharma Initiative." That is a lot of work on a lot of different products that would be entirely unnecessary if some outside source were providing it; add to that, faking it as Dharma-stuff would be a ruse without purpose. I think I remember Widmore telling... who was it?... uh, John, wasn't it?... that he funded the Dharma gig, didn't he? If so, then it was Widmore who continued to provide food for the button-pusher, whoever it may be. Why? I'm not sure, but he was there when the whole system was set up in the 60's & 70's. Maybe he is interested in the good health / or corrupted heath of the island. I don't know. Why John wouldn't grill Widmore while he had the chance, I have no idea.
I think this war between Widmore and Ben is widespread and has many tentacles.
I love this show. Its the best on TV right now.
-R.
I also noticed the night/day change when the plane started crashing and then ended up on the island during the day, just figured it was due to the time warp... however I'm not sure the "constant" has to do with anything, and am thinking Sun was left because Jacob/Christian/whoever wanted her to go on this journey which will likely be described this week.
I like all your theories about the supplies, Sun being way in the future, Dan, and The Hatch. I had totally forgotten about the "invalid" Widmore was keeping alive.. wasn't that supposed to be Faraday's mom originally?
I also just remembered that the hatch door had "the numbers" etched into them, so they must know about the numbers as they are designing the hatch so I'm just curious if they'll show the discovery of why the hatch is needed and the origin of the numbers, etc. Cannot wait until this week! I still wonder when we'll see Claire and when/if we'll see Ruth/Bernard and those other "unimportant" Losties.
I should not be thinking about Lost while trying to work, but I thought of some other things that might be interesting to y'all:
1) When we first were learning about Juliette and her association with Ben, there was some point where someone said that Juliette reminded Ben of someone from his past. I assumed (and I think others did too) that she reminded him of some previous woman he was romantically involved with. Maybe it was just someone who was a major part of his past though. An older woman who took him in under her wing perhaps... Now that Juliette actually *is* in Ben's past. Maybe that woman was *actually* Juliette!
2) When Juliette picks up Horace's baby in this past episode, she is shocked to find out that it is Ethan (the Other who did stuff like kidnapping Claire and whatnot). I realized that this shows us that Ben was not the only Dharma child who turns away from the Dharma Initiative. Ethan must have started out in the DI and not died during Ben's purging and became a hostile/Other with (or maybe before) Ben.
3) I am slightly suspicious that in this past episode it is already past the point that young Ben started becoming sympathetic to the hostiles. They didn't show the "sandwich" that Ben handed to Sayid saying it "doesn't have mustard". Maybe "mustard" is code and Ben actually handed him something to help him escape.
Ya know my first thought was that Sun and Frank are in a future time since the Dharma facilities were so trashed. From the previews it looks like there's some mass chaos in the 70s Dharmaville w/ fire and such, so I wonder if something changes in the past that makes them so trashed in the present/future time...
David - good point about Ethan, wonder how he lived through the gassing? I literally got a chill down my spine when Amy said the baby's name is Ethan, that guy was sooo creepy...
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